All fired up
26 Oct 2005 
in the early evening 
Matt Winckler
Matt: 2; LDS heretics: 0.
So I just closed the door upon some departing Mormon “elders” (I’d guess they must have been at least 17 years old), after spending a 20 minutes or so hotly engaging them. Now I’m thoroughly worked up and wish they were back, because they simply didn’t have a leg to stand on. It was pathetic, really. It was all about how the Book of Mormon is the truth because they prayed about it and God revealed it directly to them, and tripe like that. By the end of our little session, my onboard anti-Mormon weapons systems were all online and firing about 1800 rounds per minute, accusing them of crass relativism and damnable heresy, then demonstrating why my claims were true. However, since they had no real argument, they retreated to the bastion of liberalism, which is emotions. (No, they didn’t break down and cry on my doorstep…though that would have definitely been worth some bonus style points for me.) After I presented the hypothetical situation of God telling Elder Yoder one thing, and me something entirely different, and the difficulty of determining who is correct, Elder Yoder tried to explain to me how he knows what he feels is true because they are the feelings listed as the fruit of the Spirit (love, peace, and so forth). He claimed to believe that the devil could not manipulate or imitate such feelings of God. He did not seem to appreciate my derisive retort that I can walk a few blocks down to a street corner and get drugs that will imitate these feelings. Ah well.
Likewise, when trying to assert that we cannot even prove the existence of God, they didn’t seem too pleased when I proceeded to explain how I can do exactly that, using nothing but logic (thanks R.C. Sproul). Kantians! They didn’t like me raining on their parade by failing to be moved by their emphatic appeals to human emotion. (”But you see, I know this is true because I prayed and God moved me…” Good grief, it was almost as bad as debating a modern evangelical, but at least the Mormons are distinctly heretical. Less grey area or need for tact.)
For a minute I even thought we were going to get to head down Auburn Avenue when one of them brought up the argument that we are not saved by faith alone, because James says we are saved by works. I could not resist a wry smile, but I expect the irony was completely lost on him. Things were getting a little too heated at that point, because he wouldn’t listen to me explaining that I can account for that alleged “contradiction”, and could he? So we had to change the subject.
Finally one of them said that they weren’t here to debate things (good thing, too, because they seemed to have left their logic and rhetoric at home), and started walking off in mid-sentence–my sentence! No manners. He tossed a parting “God bless you” over his shoulder, and I wish I had been quicker on my feet, because I would have liked to call after him “And may God curse your damnable ‘evangelism’, and one day reveal to you the truth of His Word”. Next time! Unfortunately, if this past experience was any indicator, it’ll be another 2 and a half years before they stop by, and by that time I’ll be long gone.
It’s just too easy. I think I’m going to have to start being friendlier and more amenable so that I can stretch out their visits and prevent them from walking around spreading their filth any more than absolutely necessary. It’d be like trolling, only better, and more important too. What’s so irritating about these people, though, is the way they keep changing the subject whenever you point out how logically inconsistent they are, or talk about Brigham Young proclaiming himself the only way to salvation. It’s irritating because it’s exactly what I’d do if I were forced to bicycle around in a suit and tie defending something I had no rational basis for believing in. Pathetic, really.
My best friend is Mormon and we used to debate it all the time. It got rather old because he would literally admit that what I believed was a lot more logical, and that he couldn’t defend himself. But it just didn’t matter. He was “mormon” - that’s how he was raised, and well, that’s just how it is.
When people decide not to use logic, there’s really no use in debating them anymore. I really don’t know what to do when people act like that. The main way mormons get recruits is totally based on sociology. They get you involved with them and see what nice, friendly and helpful people they are, and you buy into it because you like them as people. No one ever gets convinced to become a mormon because they feel convinced that Native Americans are actually Jewish, and all the other nonsense mormons pedal.
It’s no wonder mormons are so often considered a cult. Nothing’s quite as strong to keep you believing something as family and social pressures. (And probably a proof of the work of the Holy Spirit that any get saved at all!)